New Main Shop Pricing System

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Seerow
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by Seerow »

How the hell is 1.5mill too high for an average? That doesn't buy you squat in today's market. I have just under 200mill right now and still don't feel like I have enough (though really I do XD ).
All these new achievements that Keith is releasing are just adding to inflation. For example, there was recently a Make a Legendary Combo achievement released. Since I'd been wanting a combo anyway, I went ahead and created one. Only to find there was another tier: for FIVE combos. Legendaries aren't cheap and if Keith is trying to eat away at our sp like this, not many people are ever going to be able to afford them. Which means people will stop paying attention to achievements since they won't be able to afford them, and that defeats their entire purpose.

I really can't honestly see any good coming from this at all. New items are of course going to be in high demand, so having them sell for 60k+ in the main shops isn't going to help a thing with deflating them before they retire. And I don't want to know how expensive the Subeatique items are going to become now 0_o
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AngharadTy
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by AngharadTy »

Through a lot of hard work and selling MCT items, I finally got up to 21M again. I have no idea how people get to 200M, I guess I'm the moron, although it would help if I'd stop buying MCTs. I have a lot of goals. My wishlist feels like it's ten miles long. If I want to have a better battle set, I have to be prepared to shell out a ton of money for a ton of legendaries and other nice things. I'm going to compromise and buy a 95% freezer because the 100% freezers cost more. The cost of 10 random items from my wishlist: 3.6M, 3M, 1M, 12M, 4.7M, 2.4M, 3.5M, 380k, 5.6M, 10M. Some of those are DPs, but most either restock (some in Subeautique, but others elsewhere) or are in the--wait for it--wait for it--Millionaire Center.

I mean, my god. Heaven forbid I spend time and save up for my goals.

That was one of the worst statements I've seen about the site in a long, long time. 1.9M is low. Very, very, very low. There's a weapon that costs 200M. I want it, oh yes I do, but it's not even on my wishlist because I will never have that much money. But if I wanted to save up for it... I would have a hell of a lot more than 1.9M by the time I got done saving.

You can't just take the "average sP" of everyone. There are always outliers. There is a better way to find a statistically significant number. And when you have awesome, worthwhile goals that can cost 200M, to tell people that they have too much money is amazingly ridiculous. It's so ridiculous that I'm kind of thinking that I'm writing this post in my sleep, because there's no way it could have been said in the first place, right?
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Wingsrising
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by Wingsrising »

What I find ironic is that when we all started playing, one of the things we liked about Subeta is that it was much easier to make money on it than it was on Neopets.

Because of the inflation on Subeta, it's been (to my mind) easier to make NP than sP for quite some time now, unless you spend a lot of real cash. Unless you battle, nothing on Neopets is really all that expensive. 1.5 million is a decent amount of NP. It's nothing in terms of sP.

Besides the cash shop, the quests are a HUGE source of inflation. I think they'd be better off making the quests give out better items and less (or no) sP.
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TCStarwind
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by TCStarwind »

I'm not seeing how this is going to help. Now, I'm no expert, but I soo no way this is going to help. Example: I take out 100k for wizard quests. Before Keith messed with those, I generally have about 20-50k left over. Tokens were cheaper then (a 15 pointer was 18k), but I sold them all and got monies. Now I do wiz quests starting with 100k, and yesterday my finishing total was 175k. And then selling 15 pointers for 50k or so will make me that much more money. And even though I didn't sell my tokens yesterday, I still shouldn't be making more money off the wiz than I'm spending.

If anything, that's where the problem is.

Hopefully I'll have this better thought out later, I have to get to class for now.
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by AngharadTy »

I lose money on the wiz, but not too much, anymore. My limit is 30k and I generally end up about 30k less than when I started, heh. I had my limit higher for a while, but it was way too irritating to spend 45k on a quest and get a 200 sP Crappy McCrap for a reward.
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Iggy
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by Iggy »

I vended tokens, and made 16M overnight. By selling crap I vended. And I still have like 5000 items to sell?
covet
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by covet »

I vended 500 items from the ocean depths machine before i realised the achievents stacked up to crazy levels, and made just over 2 mil from it. I'd have made more selling my tokens.

Now I tend to lose money from the wiz if I complete most quests - thesedays I only do quests that cost under 10k, which means about 7 - 10 quests per day. I don't sell my tokens, so I'd be kind of bummed to get no money from the wiz, as I'd either need to sell tokens and be short on those, or I'd lose up to 100k every day just from doing my 10 or so quests.

It's kind of crazy, we have DP and seasonal retirements making one end of the market sky high, and vending making the other end rock bottom. The wiz quests are about the only thing keeping a mid-range available at all.
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AngharadTy
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by AngharadTy »

I vend with the tokens I get from the wiz, so I vend kind of slowly. I've gotten a couple of old DP minions that no one wants to buy. I don't think I make money this way, heh. I wonder sometimes if I should just buy several hundred tokens, or even a thousand, and vend all at once, but... then again, I don't want ten billion one-point tokens in my inventory, and I probably can't handle the cost of investment in tokens. ;P

Like covet said, most of the items I get from vending are worthless, because everyone else gets them from vending. But at the same time, I don't have this weird demand for every item to be worth at least X sP. Just like I don't have an insane demand for people to have less than a million sP.
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Wingsrising
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by Wingsrising »

My point is that money given for quests is inflationary, full stop. I like getting sP for Wiz quests as much as the next person, but I don't like what massive sP influxes can do to prices. I think the economy would be much better off if it went back to only tokens/items, so long as people can still make money by selling the items and some of the excess tokens. If he gave out really good items more often (Subeautique rares, anyone?) then even people who kept all the tokens could still make a net profit off selling the items.

I also wonder exactly how many sP gets dumped into the system via Sag quests.

Now that I think about it, the cash shop is not inflationary, which is good because obviously the site needs it.

I'm not really sure what the best way to tackle inflation is but I really think it's from the side of restocking more items in shops and retiring them less frequently. And (much as I like new items) maybe not releasing quite as many of them.
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Goldenchaos
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by Goldenchaos »

I made money via the Item Hunt. Also stocking whenever I remembered to go buy stuff. And if this sounds like what I think it sounds like (Cheapy stuff in the markets costs over 100 times more than the normally would), then there goes my two ways to make SP.

:| Bad idea.

And yes, 1 million is WAY WAY too low in Subeta standards.

Thats like 10,000 in Neopian terms. If even that.
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mellaka
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by mellaka »

I agree that 1 mil is very low. I'm on the battle forum a lot, where people throw around amounts like 200 mil, 500 mil, 700 mil ... those are the people with too much sp, not the players with 1 mil. (I'm just using it as an example and not saying against the people personally since they may have worked very hard for that sp - I really have no idea.) The most I've ever had on the site was around 90 mil and I don't even have half of that now.

I just finally got back to doing Wiz quests again, but it sounds like they will not work out anymore. I'm probably lucky if I break even because I vend with my Wiz tokens, save vended books for the book drive, put vended plushies/beanbags in my collections, then frag anything worth less than 20k, selling what's left.

And I hope this changes back before there's ever another restock war. The r45s+ deflate so much because of the mass restocking of them, and having them increase in price because that's what everyone needs to buy to earn points ... this circular lack of logic is making my brain hurt.
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by Iggy »

Vending at Oceans Depths is silly, at best. Everyone that has access to the map vends there, and it's not a profitable machine.

Keith has said there would be a reading contest soon, minion feeding became an achievement, and Maleria quests also have an achievement.

Using these three clues, vending at Blue Sky, Dragons Hoards and Burning Chance WOULD be more profitable ;)

Always vend in more than one machine. I usually vend at 5-6 machines before pricing. (Blue Moon, Blue Sky, Burning Chance, Grave Digger, Oceans Depths and Prize Get)

I SAID ENOUGH. NO MO' INFORMATION FROM ME. I SHUT UP NOW.

(And I vended a GY Potion this week. I rock)
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by Officer 1BDI »

mellaka wrote:And I hope this changes back before there's ever another restock war. The r45s+ deflate so much because of the mass restocking of them, and having them increase in price because that's what everyone needs to buy to earn points ... this circular lack of logic is making my brain hurt.
Oh jeeze, the havoc this would wreck on the restock war hadn't even occurred to me. :?

Almost everything I was going to say has already been said. An average of 2 million sP per user does't seem like a lot given the price of so many of the (appealing) items on the site, and I also wonder if outliers were accounted for when that average was taken.

As for quests, up until this week they were actually working very well, IMO: I could only do a handful of Sagg quests each night and I usually earned less than 200k from them, and I lost sP on the Wizard but made up for it by selling the rewards and tokens. Recently, though, and especially last night, the payout for the quests seems to have been "improved." I'm spending the same amount of Wizard Quests that I usually do, and I find that I'm earning as much as 100k from the monetary rewards alone. Last night I completed a 4 item Sagg quest and got over 200k back as a reward. Perhaps it comes down to luck, but I've haven't seen a reward that high from him in ages; that's twice as much as I usually get for a 4 item quest. Now that this new pricing system is being tested, I'm wondering if quest rewards are being increased to compensate for the higher item prices.
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Usul_Princess
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by Usul_Princess »

Huggles wrote:Why? Why is it too high? Is that because if sp were US dollars that'd be high? Neopoints? What? This game is basically about amassing large quantities of items either in collections, wardrobes, galleries, or treasure chests. That's about it. So in order to play the game, one would need large amount of sp to acquire said items.
Agreed. and Echoing everyone here. Once upon a time I could tank $100.00 (Or $80.00) into a Mystical Donadak plushie, but I can't now, so I'm getting raising 100m like everyone else to get one.

It's unfair to compromise/invest cash into a site that's down or broken all the time. I've just started to play Subeta again and use Neo as a distant afterthought. Addictively playing of very recently (like last week). I tried to see if this was an older post, but no it isn't. I live through Wiz quests. I can't build sP up without them. Inflation on the site seemed to be fairly adjusted instead of too much sP in the economy. Especially since shops now appear on the search wiz if it's currently in stock and you need it for a quest. But a large change in shop price is awful, and very pointless seeing as though items in shops are overly gauged when purchased out of stores or the millionaire center.

The other 5-6 quests on the site...feh. I've had to cancel 18/30 Sagg quests on average. Pete's quests within days became pointless because a 300sP food item is now 60,000sP because one or more people also need it for their item requests. I don't even bother with anyone else. At least there's nothing in the token shop I've been eager to buy. I sell those Wiz tokens ASAP. Making 1,5+m/day is worth the endurance for a plushie, or anything else that you can't afford w/cash.

I'm slightly more than ticked off about the GA medals from once being 700K in the millionaire center, now being more than 10X that much in shops. Still 5 bucks, but long story short: sP earners can't compete with people with expendable money. For once I'm angry and will join in the complaining! :?
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Kamerynn
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Re: New Main Shop Pricing System

Post by Kamerynn »

I find it annoying when you see one price in the main shop, but when you go to buy it, it is a higher price... Ex. Arid Chai Beanbag shops in the main shop for 311 sP, but when you go to the buying page, it actually costs 467 sP.

If this is the way it's going to be now, the newer pricing should be shown in the actual shop... not change when you go to buy it. Usually, I have my fingers hovering over the numbers that I want to type for the price, so as I can be quick in trying to get an item. Now, that seems pointless, since you can't see the actual price that you need to pay until you get to the buying page.

Also, I sometimes check the prices in users shops to see if I can buy the item from the main shops and sell for a profit. Now I have to go to the buy it page to see the actual asking price and then search to see if I can sell at a profit???
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